Manual Vs Automatic

[Paul-F]

Basically I am in the process of getting a new car. I have a fairly good budget but that's besides the point. I know that almost all new drivers go go for Manual cars....but why is this?!?! I drove and passed on a Manual and found it fairly easy. However, I am told that automatic cars take the stress out of driving and hence you get a lot more enjoyment out of it etc...is this exaggerated or is this a viable argument in favour of Automatics?

Also, I'd be grateful if anyone could clear up the cost issues. I was under the impression that automatics were more expensive to buy as well as run, but some people are saying the difference is negligible?

I'd be very grateful for any comments on this as I am going to spend a fairly large sum on my car for my age and want to get it absolutely spot on.

[Exodus]

Yes, manual's are usually about $1000-$3500 cheaper then automatics. Depends on the car really.

Most people go for automatics because they are easier to drive. You can focus more on surroundings, speed, etc. Automatics use a little bit more gas then manuals do though. Manuals on the other hand, use less gas, and you have a lot more control over the power band. For example, an automatic is programmed in the car's computer to not rev over say 4200rpm's, but the max horsepower can be 5500rpms. Thats quite a bit of horsepower you aren't receiving cause the car won't allow it. A manual can rev as high as your power band goes, so you will get the power you are looking for. In the winter, manual's are easier to drive in my opinion.

Once you get used to driving manual's though, you just shift on reflex. You can be just as focused as driving normally. It just really depends what you are looking for.

[minigirl]

It just really depends what you are looking for.

and where you're driving too. if you're going to do a lot of stop start driving in the city, you'ld probably consider an automatic but manual transmission is better for most other situations - it simply gives you more control over your vehicle.

[Exodus]

Very true. Good point I forgot to cover. If you do a lot of city driving, a lot of stop & go, sidestreets, etc. You may want to consider an automatic. Manual's can be fun on long drives, or streets with good speed limits and conditions, but it becomes very annoying in heavy traffic when you et stuck in the same process . . .

Into 1st Gear. Oh wait, almost! No, damn, back on clutch - stop
Into 1st Gear. Traffic moving! 2nd gear!! Damn, stopped again, 1st . .
Into 1st gear. Traffic moving, 2nd gear! 3rd almost . . . damn. Stopped
1st Gear again . . .

The cycle becomes very annoying, specially when you've worked for 8 hours, are hungry, have to pee, and traffic just sucks, lol. However, like i said, once you drive a manual for a while, you really just do everything by instinct. So you notice the problems less and less, but they are still there.

[Guest]

In the UK automatics are nowhere near as populare as in the states and this is reflected in 2nd hand prices, a new auto will cost more than the equivalent manual but 2nd hand the auto will be the same price or cheaper.

Also a 2nd hand auto's engine will be less likely to have been abused.

With regard to driving in snow and ice, most if not all modern autos will have a winter mode that will allow for smooth pulling away in 3rd gear and will therefore be easier than doing the same in a manual.

[astrocan]

First thing to clear up is that there a two types of auto box.
1. Old fashioned 'slush box' with a torque converter which is a large bowl of oil that is spun by the engine and transmits power to an automatic gearbox, a fearsomely complex and delicate piece of engineering.
2. More modern cars have a different system where the manual gear stick is replaced by a computer controlled selection system that operates the clutch and changes the gears on exactly the same drive train as the manufactuer puts into the manual model.
The old type of box has all the vices mentioned above, low performance and heavy consumption. The more modern systems are designed to maximise the efficiency of the engine and should be at least as economical to run as the manual version.
The point about limiting the engines rev range is valid but all engines with electronic fuel management have this fitted now. Its why petrol heads first tune up trick is 're-mapping', they basically re write the software that controlls the engine.
Some people don't like the loss of control that you get with any automatic and this is a completely personal thing, I have driven some automatic trucks which are great in town where you can concentate on the traffic but if you need to do a tricky reverse I would rather have the control that a clutch gives me.
Many autos have a manual setting and I know that my Dad, (72 and far too set in his ways) always uses this, it is an easy way to change gear manually but you still lose out on the clutch control if that is important to you.
Basicaly I think you are going to have to try a couple out and see how you get on with them. Different manufacturers have different solutions to the same problem so try a few. If you are going to spend a reasonable amount of cash insist on a test drive, but try and avoid the young salesman who knows nothing and insists he knows it all, someone who is going to give you a bit of guidance will be much more helpful to you.
Just as a last thought, how about contacting a couple of driving schools and see if you can go out in one of their autos? You will get time, support and a real feel for what you may be letting yourself in for.

[minigirl]

..... or you could rent one for a day or two to see if you like it. much better than the way i first encountered an automatic - i had to use one of the office cars one day and was given the keys and running sheets - when i got to the car park i had to get out the handbook to find out how to start it!

[kinghelfer]

First thing to clear up is that there a two types of auto box.
1. Old fashioned 'slush box' with a torque converter which is a large bowl of oil that is spun by the engine and transmits power to an automatic gearbox, a fearsomely complex and delicate piece of engineering.
2. More modern cars have a different system where the manual gear stick is replaced by a computer controlled selection system that operates the clutch and changes the gears on exactly the same drive train as the manufactuer puts into the manual model.
The old type of box has all the vices mentioned above, low performance and heavy consumption. The more modern systems are designed to maximise the efficiency of the engine and should be at least as economical to run as the manual version.
The point about limiting the engines rev range is valid but all engines with electronic fuel management have this fitted now. Its why petrol heads first tune up trick is 're-mapping', they basically re write the software that controlls the engine.
Some people don't like the loss of control that you get with any automatic and this is a completely personal thing, I have driven some automatic trucks which are great in town where you can concentate on the traffic but if you need to do a tricky reverse I would rather have the control that a clutch gives me.
Many autos have a manual setting and I know that my Dad, (72 and far too set in his ways) always uses this, it is an easy way to change gear manually but you still lose out on the clutch control if that is important to you.
Basicaly I think you are going to have to try a couple out and see how you get on with them. Different manufacturers have different solutions to the same problem so try a few. If you are going to spend a reasonable amount of cash insist on a test drive, but try and avoid the young salesman who knows nothing and insists he knows it all, someone who is going to give you a bit of guidance will be much more helpful to you.
Just as a last thought, how about contacting a couple of driving schools and see if you can go out in one of their autos? You will get time, support and a real feel for what you may be letting yourself in for.

...You forgot about CVT...........the third type of Automatic.......

[Bobin]

If you are going to drive in the city a lot, an automatic may make more sense. Driving a manual in the city, where you have to stop every few hundred meters can sometimes be a pain.

Yes, the manual is going to initially cost a little less. However, with the manual, the clutch will eventually have to be replaced, and this will typically cost from about $400. to over $1000. This will offset any savings when initially buying the vehicle. The clutch in my Jeep cost about $400. to replace, on my Porsche it was a little over $1000, and those costs are 15 years ago for the Porsche, and 3 years ago for the Jeep. Both clutches lasted about 100K miles. Also, when you factor in the cost of replacing the cluch, any savings in fuel costs over the automatic are wiped out overnight.

Driving an automatic gives the feeling that there is novocaine between the engine and the wheels. Go to a dealership and test drive identical models, one with an automatic and one with a manual.

If you get a sports car, there is a factor called oversteer and understeer. In most sports cars with a manual, the rule is to drive conservatively into a curve, and hard out of the curve. In other words, to maximize fun, you accelerate around the curve, not slow down. Forget this with most automatics, driving fast around a curve feels like the car is on waterskiis. The difference feels someting like skiing vs. rollerblading.

[lakecra]

If you (Paul-F) have gotten a manual driver license, you already had your answer to choose whatever cars that you want. Don't waste your time to ask those people who don't know much about "CARS" !

[Guest]

actually, mr lakecra, all the above advice sounds pretty darn good. it does appear that everyone who responded is quite accurate in what they speak of.

[Guest]

Nearly all Mercedes in the UK are auto. Try to sell an older Mercedes with a manual box and see what you get.
Auto boxes are fine for saloons. Manual for sports cars.

[Exodus]

This will offset any savings when initially buying the vehicle. The clutch in my Jeep cost about $400. to replace, on my Porsche it was a little over $1000.

Well not meaning to point out the obvious, but of course the clutch is going to cost an arm and a leg for a Porsche. Its a sports car, and depending what model you had, it either had a stage 1+, or a dual clutch, etc. Its a sportscar, so its always more. The aftermarket clutch I had in my Z06 cost $1200 to replace, ad that was cause I had a connection, lol.

Anyways, point being. Its a clutch, and you really don't have to worry about fixing it constantly, unless you really suck at driving manual. So what if you have to pay $400 every 100K miles. Would you rather pay for a $1400+ transmission every 120K miles? Can't really say the clutch can effect the price of the car, sicne repairs happen, and all cars need them.

[minigirl]

yes, clutches (and getting them fitted) will cost you quite a bit, but if you drive properly, a clutch is not something that wears out very often. my car is 17 years old, has done about 180,000 kilometres and still has the original clutch.

[Major Grumbles]

I consider myself a bit of a guru in this field. Cars are my grounding for where I am now.

Manuals are fantastic, excellent control, if it's rear wheel drive oversteer hone these skills in industrial estates, when it's raining or snowing, understand what happens with the car. Manual - front wheel drive, monkey see monkey do, if you're heading into a corner quickly and the car wants to go straight on, let go off the accelerator, apply brakes gently and turn in - it will do what you want.

Automatic - arrive at the wrong corner in too high a gear, front wheel/rear wheel drive - it will swap ends. Automatics cannot read the road, they are programmed. Automatics with sequential shift i.e. Mercs, BMW, Audi and some Jap crap allow you to knock down a gear to give the car direction, and grip and purpose therefore no swapping of ends.

Fourwheel drive - forget it! Auto or manual, when you lose it - you're in a field or a ditch because you're just a passenger.

Autos are great in the town, expensive for emissions, in the open country they are heavier on the gallons - lazy boys cars!

Manuals are great in open country, may possibley require slightly more muscle density in the left leg for riding the clutch.

Personal preference is manual for overall control or automatics if you want to be a passenger.

Speaking from experience of selling cars, if you have an auto and you are trading it in, the dealer will say, not a big market for autos, not vey many people find they fit their budget, so it's not worth anymore. However if the same dealer is selling you an auto, expect to pay £4-600 more than the manual equivalent because you have turned up at the garage asking specifically for an auto.