As a UK Citizen what do I get out of the EU?

Are the polititians doing a good job could you do better, debate your views with others
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Postby Guest on Sat Jun 23, 2007 9:58 am

I see we've been sold donw the river again. Goodbye Britain. Hello United States of Europe. It's really nice to see your country and antionality dissappear and not be able to do a thing about it as the whole political establishment aupports the "European project"

rough silk
 

Postby rough silk on Wed Oct 24, 2007 4:42 am

So what about those straighter 'nanas, then? We would still be eating those really bent ones if it wasn't for the EU.

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Postby Guest on Fri Oct 26, 2007 9:59 am

European citizens of EU countries who mock the United States Constitution and American democracy are a bad joke. :lol:

rough silk
 

Postby rough silk on Sat Oct 27, 2007 7:15 pm

At least we can laugh at ourselves. We feel secure enough about our identity to take the p1ss out of the EU and its leaders and everyone else's leaders, for that matter.

Why do you take so much offence when we laugh at you too?

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Postby Guest on Mon Oct 29, 2007 4:09 pm

rough silk wrote:At least we can laugh at ourselves. We feel secure enough about our identity to take the p1ss out of the EU and its leaders and everyone else's leaders, for that matter.

Why do you take so much offence when we laugh at you too?

What "identity" would you have under the EU?

And you are evidently too thick to know the difference between self-deprecation and ignorant, hypocritical bigotry and mendacity. Idiot. :lol:

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Postby Guest on Thu Nov 01, 2007 6:55 am

rough silk wrote:At least we can laugh at ourselves. We feel secure enough about our identity to take the p1ss out of the EU and its leaders and everyone else's leaders, for that matter.

Why do you take so much offence when we laugh at you too?
Good question.

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Postby Love-dot on Thu Dec 06, 2007 11:54 pm

Good post above.

We have been sold out to Europe by our politicians.

We fuel the lazy lives of the Spanish and others.... they boast about leading relaxed lives, while we have to subsidise them.

The sad thing is the British people are not given a vote on wether to remain in the EU or not.

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Postby Guest on Wed Dec 12, 2007 12:22 pm

121Love-dot-com wrote:We have been sold out to Europe by our politicians.

We fuel the lazy lives of the Spanish and others.... they boast about leading relaxed lives, while we have to subsidise them.

The sad thing is the British people are not given a vote on wether to remain in the EU or not.

Well said.

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Postby Gibbous Moon on Mon Jan 14, 2008 1:17 pm

What we get from our membership of the EU includes

Free trade. I welcome the fact that I can hire a Polish builder who works hard and well; that I can buy a German car, which is well engineered and well built; that I can buy French electricity which is low carbon and from a secure source or Spanish chorizo which is lovely. In exchange I get to sell banking services.

It might not suit British builders to compete with the Poles but as a consumer of building services I think I’m better off.

Being a big player. The European Union is probably the world’s largest economy; it’s certainly on a par with the US. This means that when negotiating with other countries about trade or climate change or human rights our voice gets heard. Crucially we have a government big enough to tell even the largest corporations what to do and an economy large enough that those corporations can’t just ignore us. This means that minimum employment standards, product standards or, say, child welfare standards are enforced.

The anti-trust moves against Microsoft by the EU resulted in a massive fine.

Peace. The Germans and French being able to compete to buy Alsatian coal with money instead of tanks means that my dad and I and my children have not and will not see a European war.

Peace is nice.


GM

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Postby Guest on Mon Jan 14, 2008 3:23 pm

What you don't get is democracy.

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Postby Gibbous Moon on Mon Jan 14, 2008 5:07 pm

No, not enough democracy and progress towards more democracy is too slow.

Write to

José Manuel Barroso
President of the European commission
1049 Brussels, Belgium


GM

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Re: As a UK Citizen what do I get out of the EU?

Postby Major Grumbles on Sun Jan 20, 2008 2:11 pm

The Fonz wrote:

Freedom of work only benefits Eastern European workers, who have flooded this country and in have successfully driven down the low paid workers terms of conditions. How many of us have travelled to Poland to work?




By Alan Sugar, Daily Mail, 10/06/05 - Business section

THE FACT that we are now relying on bus drivers from Eastern Europe to shore up our public transport is a national disgrace. But I extend the warmest of welcomes to the new recruits.
The disgrace lies with the British workers who now refuse to take what they consider 'menial' jobs such as bus driving, forcing employers to look outside the country.
You can be sure the 400 drivers from Poland, Hungary and the Czech Republic - another 600 will follow later in the year - taken on by the country's largest bus company, the First group, have a completely different attitude and I'm full of admiration for them.
They will come here and work damn hard for less money than lazy Brits demand. They will master the language, their wives will go out to work and save furiously for their children's educations.
You won't catch them squandering their earnings down the pub and I'll take a bet with you that in 20 years' time some of their children will be business leaders sustaining the British economy.
In fact, the men and women from Eastern Europe who are flocking here to work remind me of the Asian immigrants of the Sixties and Seventies, and the Jewish immigrants of the Forties. Both of those ethnic minority groups came to Britain with the express desire to work and provide for their families.
They toiled uncomplainingly around the clock, stressed the value of education to their children, and now some of those boys and girls are the entrepreneurs of today.
And as for the unemployed whingers who will no doubt soon be moaning that the Poles have taken their jobs - just as they did about the Asians in years gone by - I have no sympathy for them.
The truth is they don't want to work. There have always been people who had the brains to be lawyers and doctors and accountants, and those who didn't.
The difference is, where once the less clever people took great pride in manual work and trades, now they don't. They just can't be bothered and prefer to sponge off the state. The work ethic has been consigned to history.
It was very different when I started out.
I grew up on a council estate in Hackney, East London, and joined the Civil Service. I packed it in when I realised I could make a better go of things working for myself and I became a salesman flogging car aerials. With the money I made I went on to found Amstrad, my electronics company.
My parents - my father was a tailor and my mother worked hard to bring up four children - instilled in me the strongest of work ethics, and in everything I have done I have grafted hard because I knew no other way.
But in my day that wasn't unusual. We all worked hard. When I started out, the plumber or builder or labourer who couldn't find a job took whatever employment there was, whether that was driving a bus or sweeping the street. Today's unemployed don't want to do a job for ÂŁ200 a week. They'll only get off their backsides for ÂŁ500.
Instead, they'd rather scam the social security system and do a bit of moonlighting on the side to make up the money.
I have no problem with people who aspire to better things - a more fulfilling job, a bigger salary or better lifestyle.
But everyone has to start somewhere. I think the unemployed should set their sights a little lower and begin with an honest day's graft. Then, if they have the ability, they can work their way up or set up on their own as I did.
Sadly, most people are too complacent for that; there is no shame in being out of work, nor is there any hunger to be self-sufficient.
The reason for this is twofold. In the first instance our generous social security system fosters that attitude, and secondly, the workplace is being strangled by EU legislation governing worker and human rights.
As long as the Government continues to pay higher rates of unemployment benefit than many people can earn working five days a week, a certain section of society will always take advantage of it.
There is work out there, but people don't want to do it, so they sign on and when they are offered a job they don't want to take, they turn up, pay lipservice and ask their prospective employer to fill in a form saying they were unsuitable for the position. Then they just saunter back to the social security office and collect their next benefit cheque.
As far as I'm concerned, unless there is a medical reason why a person cannot work, he or she should be in employment. Anyone still claiming benefits after three months without a job should have their benefits stopped and be forced to work.
The figures speak for themselves: there are 1.4m people unemployed in this country, yet we have more than 1,000 bus drivers' jobs lying vacant. And that's just the tip of the iceberg.
The cushion of the welfare state is also to blame for the shortage of skilled and manual labour in Britain. This means that people who once opted for these trades prefer now to rely on the state.
No wonder there are huge numbers of Eastern European plumbers, builders, carpenters and labourers over here filling the gap. I think it's time the Government addressed the problems that an over-generous welfare system has created.
The building trade is a classic example of an industry that could benefit from a modern apprenticeship system, which the Government could subsidise.
Instead of money being given away in benefits, unemployed youths should be told to report for work at their local building site and receive their benefits (as pay) that way.
But first we need to tackle the preoccupation with human rights which EU legislation has conferred on us. Modern workplaces are restricted by so much red tape they can't get on with the job in hand.
Most companies now employ lawyers who spend their whole time agonising over whether the temperature is correct and the environment pleasing enough for the employees.
Understandably, this sends out the wrong message about what is really important in business and fosters a culture of laziness.
Eastern European workers haven't had their minds poisoned in the way ours have by an obsession with human rights legislation.
Until we address these two problems, we will continue to breed a nation of workshy layabouts. And as long as we do, the only solution to our employment crisis will be to recruit from elsewhere.
Speaking as an employer, faced with a hungry, diligent Eastern European and a lazy, unmotivated Brit, I know which one I would rather employ.
Sir Alan's fee for this article has been donated to charity.


Gibbous Moon wrote: I welcome the fact that I can hire a Polish builder who works hard and well.


+1
Ok, I said to myself as I sighted the bird down the end of the gun. This time, my fine feathered friend, there is no escape.

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Postby The Colonel on Sun Jan 20, 2008 3:57 pm

I think it's about time Sir Alan became Lord Sugar.

I'd force every lazy b***** in this country out to work at rifle point if necessary. A national labour face needs to be created. The government will employ ALL the unemployed - NO EXCUSES. These people will work (cleaning parks, building roads, and an unlimited amount of tasks) they will learn on the job, the will be made to work and checked to see they are working and they will be paid a low, but honest, wage.

This would cost around a third less to do than the cost of keeping them as they are. Also, out of their earnings they would pay tax back to the government. The work they would do would help improve the economy feeding yet more money to the government to spend on the people.

Their kids (the future dole robbing scum) will learn there is NO easy option in life and that NO-ONE will keep them or their kids. This hopefully might be a kick up the backside for them leading to them concentrating on education. These people would have less time and money to drink and cause trouble - lowering crime.

If Britain is to progress - the "scrounging bastards" are the central element to deal with. If we can remove them - everything else will improve.
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Postby Gibbous Moon on Mon Jan 21, 2008 12:01 pm

I’ve been mulling over the idea of a peaceful nation service. I’m generally in favour.

I think that to be “fair” it should have some kind of skills exchange. I don’t think you should compel people to manual labour and then not give them the opportunity to learn skills that make them employable.

Sort of a New Deal. The worker gets to learn useful skills (including the dignity of labour), the state that supports them gets useful stuff done, and the economy generally gets an increased pool of semi-skilled labour.

For the scheme to work; for it not to institutionalise a pool of free labour available to the market which would drop the bottom out of the general labour market, the scheme would need to only direct labour to projects that would otherwise not be done (or perhaps things that the tax payer would be paying for). Not sure how you police this. Even restricting the scheme to charities doesn’t guarantee that the scheme won’t distort the labour market. They probably need to be one off projects.

Things I’d like to see done are

Canal reclamation
Conversion of waste ground to landscaped park
Path way construction in national parks
Filling sandbags during floods.

GM

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Postby Guest on Sun Jun 08, 2008 9:05 pm

to the title of this thread - the reply is 'sweet fa' & the sooner we get out of the EU the better

where is our referendum

and another insidious subject is 'common purpose' Look that one up on Youtube - there is an ex UKIP guy with a 1 hour film on the subject - quite frightening when you think of strange forces in every walk of life here in the uk - unelected - but making sure decisions go a 'certain way'

Even Gordon Brown in his speeches has used the words 'for the commom purpose' quite often - think back - you will recall them

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