Stretch Marks!!

[Bohemus]

Hello,
No, I am not associated with any company. I am quite conservative with all the treatments but I am also interested in practicing medicine and not quasi medicine.
I believe you are overestimating the "studies" you may have in mind. No, there is not a single scientifically valid study that shows any effect of the technique; not positive and not negative.
Please look in the biggest scientific library in the world, Medline, that has all medical studies done around the world within the last several decades. These include studies published in all imaginable languages.
If you find one I will be grateful to advance my knowledge.
The problem is that too many big and small companies around the world take advantage of the aesthetic needs of mostly women.
Only you can decide whether it works in your estimation or whether you need true science to tell you that it works. I just think it is silly to pay for something that is "hot" but not proven although one can claim to to the study.
Always look at: who sponsors the study? what financial involvement exist between investigator and the company? how the study is design? how many subject completed the study? and many more variables.

Anyway, I think the forum like this is great and, believe it or not, very educational for me.
Thanks!

MD from TN

Hello,
The Derma Rollers were introduce in order to enhance delivery of various ingredients into the skin. Certainly, I don't know too much about this technique but discussing this subject during recent World Congress of Medical Aesthetics in Paris I have an impression of rather woodoo method. There has never been an independent controlled study that would shed any light on this technique. I may be wrong but seems to me the rollers are "the newest" toys on the aesthetic playground. I would invest in something that is known to produce positive effects rather than in fancy rollers that will end up serving as a tool to tenderize your stake.
All the Best,

MD in TN

Hi Bohemus,

Would you mind sharing with us your motivation for being on this board as you do not seem to be afflicted with stretchmarks like the rest of us?

Are you really a medical professional and do you have a financial stake in promoting laser treatment?

I use a dermaroller regularly and purchased it from a well known dermatologist in Sydney Australia and not some quack on ebay.

Skin microneedling as the technique is called actually has quite a few independant published studies available which prove it to be highly effective in not just delivering ingredients further into the skin but promoting collagen formation without destroying the epidermis unnecessarily like most lasers do. Also without the huge price tag!

Regards
PJ

[cr]

Dermarollers are definitely a touchy subject, nevertheless, it is nice to hear all opinions so that one can make an educated decision. Because of the big expense of rollers, plus, the needles dull after about 50 or so uses, it may be too big of an expense to bother with. If you do so choose to buy one, there are good sellers on ebay that offer high quality rollers. But, like Bohemus has said there is no evidence that they truly are effective. I, personally, feel like it has improved my results enough, though meager, to continue to use it. Eventually, I will upgrade to slightly longer needles. But, then again, other methods, such as abrasion and copper peptides may be just as effective for other people. Again, it is great to hear so many perspectives on dermarollers.

[Bohemus]

Hello CR,
I think it would be beneficial, from scientific point of view, to do the following: if you noticed an improvement while using roller with topical, try to compare no roller plus topical with roller only without topical. You can never exclude simple physical skin irritation as a positive stimulus.

Thanks!

MD from TN

For the guest who inquired about Dermarollers:
I purchased my roller _ at Amazon (the basic Leaf and Rusher model, about .50 mm, I think), and I paid about $100 US dollars. They are also available on ebay, but as you mentioned, they can be expensive. I have never felt like my dermaroller tenderized my skin, but then again, I have a model that has very short needles, and is the least invasive. There is the argument that the needles need to be above 1.0mm in order to reach the dermal layer and be effective. Although, I am not too sure of actual case-studies that support this. But, I can share my experience with you, and I have found that my dermaroller has maximized my results. I am using it with copper-peptides now, and before that I used it with Trilastin. I went through a few months of doing each topical cream without the roller, and then with it, and I found the benefits of needling to be pretty instaneous. When you work with your skin so tediously for such a long time, you begin to understand what works on your skin and what does not work. I have found that the dermaroller improves my marks moreso than without it. I would not say the improvement is immense, but enough to continue with it as part of my routine. The reason I like the roller is because a lot of my stretch marks are depressed and I feel like the needles push the CP's into the indentations more effectively than just rubbing it into the deep marks. If your marks are not indented then possibly doing other methods, such as copper-peptides and hydroxy acids, may yield better results for you. I hope this helps!

[cr]

Hi Bohemus,
That is a very good point, but I am not using skin irritation as a sign of improvement. What I notice is that my stretch marks appear less noticeable over time when I use the roller as opposed to not using it. It would be a good idea to test the roller on my skin without any topical creams and see what happens. But, I am far too determined to remove these marks than to devote precious time to doing that method because I want to purely focus on removing something that makes me feel so sad. Thank you for the insight, though.

[RandomWords]

Are copper peptides THE thing to use with a dermaroller? Does anybody know a good source for them in the UK?

[Tracy212]

The cost for an area the size of the face varies from clinic to clinic in the United States, but the clinic I used charges $2,200 for the face and that is the price they gave me for my whole abdomen. I am very small (5'4" and 110 pounds). The doctor said they were about the same "acreage".

Not sure of prices in the UK.

Tracy

[Tracy212]

The above price was for the Active FX.

Tracy

[Guest]

I know this is a forum for ladies but im afriad its the only
place I could find _ with active fraxel related posts.

I have a very unique problem.

I'm 22 today but around 7 months ago when I was 21
I developed a long stretch mark on my penis from
a short lapse of priapism ( unwanted constant erections )
because the skin on the penis is very thin say about 5 mm
total, its very sensitive whenever it brushes on my body hair.
Also I developed varicose veins which I managed to treat
effectively using homeopathy and vitamin / zinc pills.
Its still there the veins but not as protruding as before nor
as painful to the touch as before.

Now back to the stretch mark... the main stretch mark runs
from under the base till the foreskin, but now the even more
serious problem which is scaring is that my foreskin is also
turning into a stretch mark, its lost a lot of density, its thinned
lost its elasticity and wrinkles and water retetion is a lot more.
Technically, the entire foreskins turned into a stretch mark like
area including the musocal membrane.

I've been using creams and all that stuff but they are temporary.
I cannot go through a day without creams because they are
my only hope to give my skin some amount of thickness to
last me through the day without it being stretched into painful
lengths.

I've been doing intensive research down to microbiology and
biochemistry aswell as dermatology hournals where I've found
doctors saying fraxel is safe and effective on the genital areas.

I'm really scared a.
I cant afford fraxel treatment right now b.
I live with a family and in a place where beauty treatments are shunned upon c.

I dont consider this a beauty treatment because it has, literally..
ruined my daily life, being a guy and having to depend on a cream
to stop my penis from hurting everyday, that includes bleeding
after using creams from rubbing on clothes.

the main stretch mark which runs under the shaft is probably
safe to incision out but I dont know how it'll play a role in my erections.

But I'm worried about the foreskin more,
since fraxel and all thse lasers are mainly pushed to going "deeper"
my problem dosnt really need deep, max 3 I'd say on the main stretch
mark and 2mm on the foreskin.

Would my problem and skin being so thin make it easier for
fraxel to be effective on me ?
I intend to get it done on my entire penis because it has a lot
of other smaller stretch marks which give me daily aches
and unwanted water retention.

Hello,
The Fraxel laser is a different laser emitting a light of much shorter wavelenght than CO2 laser (Active FX or Deep FX). Therefore the tissue penetration is much deeper with Active FX.
There was an interesting study comparying both with a "split face" approach. The subjects had half of their faces done with Fraxel and other half with Active FX. The side where Active FX was used was treated once and the Fraxel site 5 times, 3 or 4 weeks apart (I just do not remember).
Along the way all patients had skin biopsies done for objective comparison. The results were also evaluated using traditional scoring system used by the independent observers. The results were overwhelmingly positive on the Active FX side (only one treatment session).
However, please remember these were done on the face and not on stretch marks. Extrapolating is sometimes deceiving but logic suggests that similar results could be expected on other parts of the body.
When you add to Active FX the Deep FX (with even deeper skin penetration) one could expect even better results.
I am trying Active FX immediately after IPL in order to achieve tissue heating at various levels. Once I have anything to report I will share with you with my results. Yes, there is a good chance that this combination will not make a significant impact but this is the only way to find out.

Thanks!

MD from TN

Hi everybody,
I have decided to give lasers a try in battling my stretchmarks. The thing is, I am unsure of which laser I should have done. The new CO2 fraxel (fraxel re:pair) is said to only need 1 or 2 treatments as apposed to more with the older fraxel. I have also seen pictures of the results of this laser that look very promising. However, everybody on this board seems to talk about active fx. Does anybody know anything about the fraxel re:pair (NOT the old one) compared to active FX? Thanks!

[aussiemum]

PJ, thank you so much for your kind words. Hormone levels was the cause of 90 percent of my stretch marks. Water intake, diet, stress and nutritional status covered the rest. I can't undo my past, but I'll try to create a future with less marks and pain. More than anything, though, I just want to feel free again.

I am going to take up my gym membership, because as you said, I need to work all angles of my body to get the maximized results. I have already started with vitamins, and I'm buying some zinc pills this afternoon. More veggies, fruits, water, less moping around, and maybe I'll get somewhere. I appreciate the input! You started off my day with a smile.

Oh, one more thing. Do you buy the products you use from local stores, or from the net? I think I'll start looking into copper peptides.

Girl-Lost

Hi Girl-lost

I am happy to help in any way I can.

I just want to add that there are many things out there that will help your stretchmarks.

Having said that, you will find that most will give you minimal or disappointing results if you use them alone. Copper peptides are a great product but need to be used as part of a routine. Just google skin biology and spend a bit of time reading as much of the information there that you can find before you make up your mind to order. I must warn you though that the website is quite confusing but informative nonetheless.

Don't fall into the trap that stronger is better, just work your way up. That goes for any of the acids etc if you decide to try them. I think the most important thing is not to cause yourself harm or further scarring.

I have no doubt that all the lifestyle changes you are making will help to enhance your stretchmark removal routine. I would strongly suggest though that you add daily dry skin brushing with a natural bristle brush as it can do no harm at all and may do a lot of good. I believe it is one of the main reasons my s/ms have blended into my skin so quickly and the brush only costs about $5.

Good luck with your journey and please share your progress with us!


Warm Regards
PJ

[aussiemum]

Hello CR,
I think it would be beneficial, from scientific point of view, to do the following: if you noticed an improvement while using roller with topical, try to compare no roller plus topical with roller only without topical. You can never exclude simple physical skin irritation as a positive stimulus.

Thanks!

MD from TN

Hi Bohemus,

The Department of Dermatology, School of Medicine, Dongguk University has carried out two independant studies along these lines that may interest you. One is Collagen Induction Therapy (IPL vs Micro Needling) and the other is Transepidermal Drug Delivery System (Micro Needle Therapy System) by Professor Kim Joon. I believe these studies were presented at a Medical Conference in 2006. Might be worth a look.

Regards
PJ

[aussiemum]

Hi CC & J,

I was happy to read your posts about your continuing progress. Thank you so much for sharing your methods for success!

CC you are so lucky to only get 4 stretchmarks from pregnancy...
thats where I got most of mine. No surprise really as I ended up really huge and the baby was 10pound 10ozs.

Do you mind if I ask if you are getting any success with repigmentation of your marks and if so what do you attribute that to? Do you suffer from any hyperpigmentation?

I agree with you about the effectiveness of tca vs glycolic acid, I'm going to add that to my routine too once it comes in the post. I'm just using up stuff at the moment that I've already got.

Catch you later
PJ

[Bopps]

Hi i've had stretch marks for a year after he birth of my daughter and i feel suicidal. They are really bad. I look like i have been scratched by a tiger.

I've heard of the Dr Nabet treatment, that invovles injections of carbon dioxide into the area and it apparently plumps up the area and helps oxygen levels, blood supply and produces collagen, therefore making stretch marks less visble. Its £100 per session and will probably need about 4 sessions. I think i'm going to give it a go. has anyone else tried it?

[Bohemus]

Hello,
Thanks for the link. I think it is great that the research goes in all possible directions since this is the only way to move forward.
The study by Kim Beom Joon (http://www.clinicalresolution.com/main/MTS-kimbeomjoon.pdf) is not easy to read since the photographs really do not show a significant difference except a set with facial scar...it seems the scar had chaged to hypertrophic although this could be just a difference with photo technique.
Othe interesting factor that could be interesting is the use of IPL only. If you are looking for a specific effect and include more than one variable it is essential to show the effect of each separately before combination. Sometimes the effect is opposite, sometimes cumulative sometimes nothing at all.
But, it is interesting. Thanks again!

MD in TN

Hello CR,
I think it would be beneficial, from scientific point of view, to do the following: if you noticed an improvement while using roller with topical, try to compare no roller plus topical with roller only without topical. You can never exclude simple physical skin irritation as a positive stimulus.

Thanks!

MD from TN

Hi Bohemus,

The Department of Dermatology, School of Medicine, Dongguk University has carried out two independant studies along these lines that may interest you. One is Collagen Induction Therapy (IPL vs Micro Needling) and the other is Transepidermal Drug Delivery System (Micro Needle Therapy System) by Professor Kim Joon. I believe these studies were presented at a Medical Conference in 2006. Might be worth a look.

Regards
PJ

[Guest]

Bopps, apparently you havnt been reading this board for too long. if you scrolled back a few pages you would find that two people here have tried carboxy therapy with absolutely no results. You can try of course but personally I'd wait until someone else had something to show for it.

[cr]

Hi PJ,
I feel so fortunate to have only gotten four stretch marks from pregnancy. My son was 8 lbs 5 oz., which is usually considered a big baby, especially, on my petite 5"3' frame. But, OMG, all of my blessings go out to you for delivering a baby over 10 lbs.!!! WOW!! I attribute skin brushing and massaging my skin with vitamin E, and olive oil oil a few times a day for the prevention of many stretch marks, especially, because I have a propensity for these marks. The marks that I got from pregnancy started off a deep purple and have slowly faded in with my natural skin tone, I just have to work on the texture now. I attribute the fading to the glycolic acid peels, after I do a peel, I notice my skin gets an even glow. I only had hyper-pigmentations problems once. I was aggressively working on my stretch marks and doing 70% glycolic peels twice a day for a week (leaving it on 7-9 minutes). My skin did have a reaction and I stopped doing the peels for a week. It took a week for my skin to return back to normal. I feel like my drmaroller helps with the texture of my marks. I am not sure if your marks are indented. But, most of mine are. Also, one mark that I got from pregnancy on my stomach, just above my belly-button is slightly raised, and I could feel scar tissue under the skin. It was raised for the first year and a half post-partum,I started using the dermaroller and the needling seem to help break down the scar tissue and now it is level with my skin. It is also great for my indented marks too! Like you, I love my dermaroller! TCA peels frightened me at first, but when diluted, my body responds very well to it. I wish you the best in your stretch mark success and motherhood!
CR